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Chain of Title ommisions

The mystery of Land Patents unveiled.

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Mikefeilen
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Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Mikefeilen » Wednesday January 15th, 2014 3:23 pm MST

Hi Everyone!
This is my first post here.
When in the process of bringing a Land Patent forward and there are missing documents regarding the buy/sell agreements or in the case of death...a will...one finds that there is one or more gaps in that chain. The question is this: If there are no supporting documents at one or more points in the buy/sell agreements going back to the original Land Patent does this affect the end result and strength of the Land Patent? The County Recorder may say that going back 100 years or more in the search it is more than likely that documents may not have been recorded consistently as they are today. Your thoughts?

Also, would it make sense to have the County Recorder sign some type of Affidavit regarding the omissions in the Chain of Title at the Recorders Office. Basically stating something along the lines of (there are missing documents but the Recorders Office recognizes that the property in question is certified by their office to be accurate and true and is linked to the original Land Patent. Maybe someone out there would have a solid way of stating this so it can be put into an Affidavit?

Thanks!
Mike

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby KingWm » Wednesday January 15th, 2014 6:50 pm MST

Welcome Mikefeilen,
I can't answer the first question, but as to the affidavit, I am certain no County Clerk would sign such a document (at least not in their right mind). There may be many reasons for this, but the first that comes to mind is that the County Clerk doesn't know if there are any gaps in the chain of title or not. It is not the clerk's responsibility to research property records (or even understand the contents) and they won't (or are not supposed to) give any sort of legal advice. Their responsibility is simply to record documents and serve as guardian. They don't certify that documents are true and correct, only (that I am aware of) that the copies are true and correct copies of the originals. There is no way they would stick their neck out, and I doubt it would have any bearing on the desired outcome, which is perfected chain of title. However, I am curious about the remedy for this problem as well.

KingWm

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Copacetic » Wednesday January 15th, 2014 7:05 pm MST

Gentlemen,
I think your best course of action would be to seek out the last person that held the land rights and had a documented chain of title all the way back to the original land grant. If this person cannot be found then I would seek out one of their heirs. Once I found either one of those I would convince them to make an assignment of land rights to me.

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Mikefeilen » Thursday January 16th, 2014 10:50 am MST

Thank you for your replies!
There is only one living heir which is the person the property was purchased from and she is in her late 70's.
I have already spoken to her and I actually have more knowledge of the property's history than she does. She does not have any documentation other than the buy sell agreement. The property is located in a very rural/small town area and I know that there is not a chance anyone else that has any more info than I have collected at the County Recorders Office. So the question is: The only person that would be able to sign off on a assignment of land rights would be the previous owner. No other living previous owners. Would this assignment take care of the gaps in the Chain of Title or is there something else that would need to be done?

As far as the County Recorders office not being aware of the gaps: Actually they do. This is very small rural area and the girls in the office were actually helping me research the property. This sure wouldn't happen in a larger city!

I will research the assignment of land rights but other than that I'm kind of stuck at this point.

Any further help is appreciated!

Thanks for responding!
Mike

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Copacetic » Thursday January 16th, 2014 11:28 am MST

Mike,
If this lady you speak of does not have a documented chain of title from the original land grant to her then she is not be the best person to get the assignment from. (if she cannot prove through documented chain of title that she does possess the land rights then how will you ever prove under legal challenge that she assigned the land rights to you?) You need to go back farther in the chain to find a person who has undeniable documented chain of title back to the original land grant (or their heirs). Even going farther in the chain of title and finding the person to which the original land grant was issued (or their heirs) would suffice to prove your ownership of the land rights.

If you read a land grant it will plainly state that the grant is made to the person so named on the grant, their heirs, and assigns FOREVER. Meaning it cannot be changed. If you ever become a land owner you will forever remain an assign/heir on that grant.

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Mikefeilen » Thursday January 16th, 2014 12:54 pm MST

Looks like I didn't explain myself....I'm sorry everyone!
I do have the original Certified Land Patent from the BLM.
The Land Description on the Land Patent reads the same as the Land Description on the most current Warranty Deed with the exception of 20 acres which was sold to another party and I do have the Docs, showing that sale.

What I have been trying to do is assemble a accurate Chain of Title linking the current Warranty Deed to the Original Land Patent. There are gaps....there is no possible way to resolve this since there is only one living person who is involved in the said Chain. She has no supporting docs. The County Recorder admits that there are gaps and that there is one Grantors Index that is missing which more than likely is the index that would help in our search....at least for one or maybe two gaps....not all three.

That is my dilemma!

What I am having a hard time understanding is the importance of a completed Chain. The original Land Patent has the Land Description and the most current Warranty Deed Land description matches as do all the other buy/sell/heir agreements in between. Granted there are unresolved gaps....but the Land description on the original Land Patent shows that it is directly linked to the most current Deed. On the Original Land Patent is says (to his heirs, the above described: To have and to hold the same, together with all rights, privileges, immunities, and appurtenances, of whatsoever nature, there unto belonging, unto the said (name)and to his heirs and assigns forever. So my thinking is: why would it matter if the Chain of Title is complete? All of the buy/sell/heir agreements in essence have the same protection as the original Land Patent. All of the previous owners fall under one of the 3 categories for the land being conveyed to them. The Gaps would also fall under the same umbrella correct? The Land description follows all the way through from 1858 to present. The owners in the Gaps either were given the property, purchased the property or inherited the property. So under these conditions the Land Patents protection holds true.
Am I way off base here?

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Copacetic » Thursday January 16th, 2014 5:08 pm MST

Mikefeilen wrote:. There are gaps....there is no possible way to resolve this since there is only one living person who is involved in the said Chain.
Mike,
Any of the 'heirs' of the 'assigns' on this grant will do. Providing there is a documented chain of title to them from the original land grant. I just find it hard to believe that there are no living assigns or heirs of assigns with a complete documented chain of title on this land. If this is indeed true then forgive my disbelieve and you really should speak with the admin about the law of jubilee.

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Admin » Thursday January 16th, 2014 7:46 pm MST

:h: Mikefeilen:
Ok; so, we apologize for Admin’s absence for the holidays and we are glad to be back and hope to be of assistance here now that we have returned. Also, please be aware that the level of support necessary to help you resolve the issue at hand would require Team Law beneficiary support; so, given that parameter, we shall go back to some of the elements of this topical thread that we can address and do our best to give you a leg up on understanding some of the things that need some clarification.
  1. We have noticed that a lot of people use the phrase: “bring a Land Patent forward”; however, the phrase is meaningless because the land patent is what it is “a Land Grant made patent”, its duration is “forever” and it directly names all of the parties that will ever have any right to the land with relation to the land patent. Therefore, because it is “patent”, neither its content nor its effect can ever be changed. Of course, that means it cannot be “brought forward.”
  2. Respectively, because the land patent is the “Title”; and, the chain of title from the land patent to the present proves the parties named on the patent [with the phrase: “and to their heirs and assigns forever”], if you do not have a complete chain of title from the patent to the present showing that you are either an heir or an assign, then you do not have land patent secured land rights.
  3. KingWm was absolutely correct noting that no court, clerk or recorder would ever sign any instrument regarding any gaps and if you were able to find one that was so foolish as to participate with such an instrument it would have no beneficial effect; in fact, it would imply fraud. Again, nothing but a perfected chain of title can secure land patent secured rights. Though there are ways to perfect such a chain of title support at that level requires Team Law beneficiary support.
We hope this information is helpful to you.
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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Mikefeilen » Friday January 17th, 2014 9:40 am MST

Thank you so much for your replies!

Yes I guess it does seem strange that there is only one living person that is directly involved with the Chain of Title. But it is in fact true. She is 78 years old. All previous owners are long gone. The property has been owned within their family since 1916 though Quit Claim Deeds, Warranty Deeds and Inheritance. which I have a solid Chain to that point back in time. Previous to that is where the gaps occur.
After reading your comments and I had sometime to think I decided that I will go back to the Recorders Office Monday. In a previous posting I wrote about the fact that one of the Grantors Index Books is missing....and has been missing for a very long time according to the County Recorders office. That Index more than likely would have solved most if not all of the gaps. My only recourse is to physically go through all of the docs. one by one during that time period in which the missing index would cover. Even though the index is missing does not mean the actual docs. are not there. Not much else I can think of doing at this point.
Correct me if I'm wrong....the only reason for having a complete Chain of Title would be in the event of an adverse claim. This claim would be contested by someone who would have to have certified documents supporting their claim. At least that's my understanding....
Now if after posting the documents in a public place for the required time passes and I record the documents does this action secure the Land Patent? If I am unsuccessful in filling in all of the gaps the chances of someone else having an adverse claim is basically ZERO. If the Land Patent is recorded without out an adverse claim will the Patent stand?
I can't believe I'm the only guy that has had this problem....funny....if there's going to be an unusual problem I more than likely find it! Well if nothing else I am learning a lot and hopefully this experience will help others in the future.
I really appreciate all of your help. Thank you soooooo much!
Mike

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Admin » Friday January 17th, 2014 10:57 am MST

:h: Mike:
As we noted in our last post, the level of support you are asking for requires Team Law beneficiary support; so, until you are a Team Law beneficiary; yet we can remind you that we already answered your question with regard to the reason for securing the Complete Title—which is: to secure the rights conveyed in the Title (the Land Patent). There is virtually no possibility that a Land Patent will not stand. The question is: “Do you have rights to that Title?”

We have a situation where an ancient family farm encompassed seven square miles of what is now a major metropolis in Pennsylvania. Every one thought that the farm had been sold by the old family patriarch after all of his children had been married and moved off on their own. Now hundreds of years later and old trunk has been discovered that indicated that when that patriarch died he still owned the land and was actively renting the same to a sharecropping tenant. After the patriarch died the sharecropper sold the real estate as if it was his own—which was a fraudulent sale. Given that fraud has no statute of limitations it turns out that the inherent heirs of the family still own all of that land and the property appurtenant to the same—so ruled the federal court.

Thus, when outstanding but incomplete records seem clear enough the possibilities of someone else having Title remains.

Nonetheless, to delve further into this matter will require Team Law beneficiary support; so, at this time we wish you well and look forward to hearing from you when you are a Team Law beneficiary.

We hope this information is helpful to you.
Tell everybody about Team Law! :t^:
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and of our spouses, our children, and our peace.
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As with all Forum posts, comments made by Admin are:
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Mikefeilen
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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Mikefeilen » Sunday April 27th, 2014 2:12 pm MDT

Hello Everyone,
I have successfully recorded my Land Patent Sandwich at the County Recorders Office.
[Redacted by Admin]
Thanks, Mike

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Re: Chain of Title ommisions

Postby Admin » Monday April 28th, 2014 5:22 am MDT

:h: Mike:
Some of the content of your post was redacted because its content did not comply with the Forum Rules most particularly with Rule 5 and Rule 31. Respectively, you will be getting a private message from Admin later today regarding the content of that message that should be helpful to you.

We hope this information is helpful to you.
Tell everybody about Team Law! :t^:
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and of our spouses, our children, and our peace.
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As with all Forum posts, comments made by Admin are:
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